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bhouston 9 hours ago [-]
I love the consistent CPU performance gains that Apple generates, always between between 15% to 30%.
I know this is the standard since the Apple got on the ARM train, but for over a decade from 2008 to 2020 in the Intel world, there was very few significant gains like this. The best you got was like 10% and it wasn't even a yearly release cadance.
bensyverson 8 hours ago [-]
And 20% YOY compounds quickly… If the speed doubles in 4 years and the RAM situation gets better, we could be looking at some very capable on-device models in 2030.
Synaesthesia 4 hours ago [-]
Not to mention GPU performance, which has also steadily improved.
The A20 Pro has about the same GPU performance as an M1 Pro, according to the Metal GPU benchmark. Very impressive.
aurareturn 8 hours ago [-]
Sometimes Intel chips would regress generation on generation. Broadwell in 2015 was sometimes 10% slower than the generation it replaced.
pachouli-please 8 hours ago [-]
Very quick, but I wonder how much of it comes from the clock speed bump (4.93 GHz from 4.26 GHz, +15.7%) instead of overall platform IPC improvements.
If it were largely clock speed, I worry we'll find that thermal throttling makes these numbers only generally available in the lab or very short bursts before the device gets too warm.
That said, very excited for what that means for the Neo laptops with more thermal headroom once they get a refresh, and if it happened to be this chip. Though I suppose that is unlikely, as they seem to be adopting a strategy of using past-gen chips for Neo.
BugsJustFindMe 7 hours ago [-]
> "I wonder how much of it comes from the clock speed bump (4.93 GHz from 4.26 GHz, +15.7%)"
About 15.7%.
> "If it were largely clock speed, I worry we'll find that thermal throttling makes these numbers only generally available in the lab"
Going from TSMC's 3nm N3P to 2nm N2 process reduces overall power consumption and thermal output by more than 15%. The reason they're able to boost the clock is because they have new headroom. It also increases the thermal density, which means the heat that's generated needs to be moved more quickly, which is probably why they also have new thermal management.
ch_sm 7 hours ago [-]
I can imagine that the new vapour chamber they’re introducing helps or is necessary to run this chip at high speeds.
aurareturn 9 hours ago [-]
Absolutely massive improvement in CPU performance in a single year. Looks like TSMC N2 is going to be a very good node.
+22% faster single thread
+34% faster multi thread
+40% GPU
This is suppose to be the generation that Apple wants to fast forward because they want to put more resources into the M7 generation for local AI. There are no M6 Pro/Max/Ultra planned.
bhouston 9 hours ago [-]
I think the key AI improvement is that these chips double the memory bandwidth and this has been the main limit for AI performance recently, became LLMs do not fit into cache.
aurareturn 9 hours ago [-]
They should use LPDDR6 which is a sizable improvement but the other thing they can do is increase prompt processing even further.
jnwatson 2 hours ago [-]
This is like the good ol' days of the x86 wars. Mo' cache, mo' GHz.
I find it impressive that these pocket computers are running at almost 5 GHz now.
_fw 12 hours ago [-]
A blazing fast chip, even by Apple standards. Exceeds M5 iPad Pro in single core for a new record.
It even surpasses the iPad Pro M3 on multi-core, so very capable indeed.
I wonder if we could get MacBook Neos with this chip instead of the A18.
bhouston 9 hours ago [-]
I think it depends on the MacBook Neo refresh frequency.
When the MacBook Neo was released this year, it used the latest A-series chip (although non Pro version.). So when it is refreshed I suspect it will again use the latest A-series chip, but the non Pro-version.
Is it going to be refreshed yearly or bi-yearly? We will find out I guess around March 2027.
dagmx 7 hours ago [-]
You have that exactly backwards. The MacBook Neo released with the previous years A series Pro chip.
It’s currently got an A18 Pro.
13 hours ago [-]
znpy 9 hours ago [-]
looking forward to have this in a macbook neo
also, i don't know much memory that chip has, but i guess the A20 Pro could also be viable for low-end macbooks air.
edit: nevermind, just 12gb. still a good candidate for a macbook neo.
throwa356262 14 hours ago [-]
Reminder that despite their claims, geekbench results cannot be compared across platforms.
They don't only cover CPU and GPU but some OS components that can look very different on different platforms.
aurareturn 9 hours ago [-]
geekbench results cannot be compared across platforms.
Why not?
dagmx 7 hours ago [-]
Because it ruffles x86 feathers, despite geekbench corresponding very closely to SPEC as well and there being no indication that the results aren’t comparable.
What people willfully conflate this with often is that you shouldn’t compare FLOP numbers between GPU arches and instead rely on benchmarks.
throwa356262 3 hours ago [-]
No, because the software layers between GeekBench and the hardware are not identical on all targets.
dagmx 1 hours ago [-]
Geekbench when run on Asahi Linux is practically the same as when run on macOS, just like Linux and Windows in the same x86 chip don’t give significant differences.
BonoboIO 6 hours ago [-]
Imagine what a bunch of the could do in some kind of blade servers, very low power usage beasts for just hosting things or low to medium computing.
Just dreaming.
gib444 10 hours ago [-]
Is it fast enough for Apple to disable transitions in the UI?
just kidding, I know Apple knows better - UIs are meant to have lag :)
I know this is the standard since the Apple got on the ARM train, but for over a decade from 2008 to 2020 in the Intel world, there was very few significant gains like this. The best you got was like 10% and it wasn't even a yearly release cadance.
The A20 Pro has about the same GPU performance as an M1 Pro, according to the Metal GPU benchmark. Very impressive.
If it were largely clock speed, I worry we'll find that thermal throttling makes these numbers only generally available in the lab or very short bursts before the device gets too warm.
That said, very excited for what that means for the Neo laptops with more thermal headroom once they get a refresh, and if it happened to be this chip. Though I suppose that is unlikely, as they seem to be adopting a strategy of using past-gen chips for Neo.
About 15.7%.
> "If it were largely clock speed, I worry we'll find that thermal throttling makes these numbers only generally available in the lab"
Going from TSMC's 3nm N3P to 2nm N2 process reduces overall power consumption and thermal output by more than 15%. The reason they're able to boost the clock is because they have new headroom. It also increases the thermal density, which means the heat that's generated needs to be moved more quickly, which is probably why they also have new thermal management.
+22% faster single thread
+34% faster multi thread
+40% GPU
This is suppose to be the generation that Apple wants to fast forward because they want to put more resources into the M7 generation for local AI. There are no M6 Pro/Max/Ultra planned.
I find it impressive that these pocket computers are running at almost 5 GHz now.
It even surpasses the iPad Pro M3 on multi-core, so very capable indeed.
All iOS devices on Geekbench: https://browser.geekbench.com/ios-benchmarks
Also, a max frequency of 4.93Ghz according to Geekbench!
When the MacBook Neo was released this year, it used the latest A-series chip (although non Pro version.). So when it is refreshed I suspect it will again use the latest A-series chip, but the non Pro-version.
Is it going to be refreshed yearly or bi-yearly? We will find out I guess around March 2027.
It’s currently got an A18 Pro.
also, i don't know much memory that chip has, but i guess the A20 Pro could also be viable for low-end macbooks air.
edit: nevermind, just 12gb. still a good candidate for a macbook neo.
They don't only cover CPU and GPU but some OS components that can look very different on different platforms.
What people willfully conflate this with often is that you shouldn’t compare FLOP numbers between GPU arches and instead rely on benchmarks.
Just dreaming.
just kidding, I know Apple knows better - UIs are meant to have lag :)